Wing describes his own genuine, unique, and effective way of standing out while building his brand.
Wing describes his own genuine, unique, and effective way of standing out while building his brand.
Welcome to Elevating Brick and Mortar. A podcast about how operations and facilities drive brand performance.
On today’s episode, we talk with Wing Lam, Co-Founder and Owner of Wahoo’s Fish Taco. Wahoo’s is a fast-casual taco chain that serves tacos full of Asian and Brazilian influences, with over 50 locations across the country and Japan.
Guest Bio:
Wing Lam co-founded Wahoo’s Fish Taco in 1988 with his two brothers Ed and Mingo. Wing has nearly 40 years of experience in the restaurant industry.
Wing makes appearances as the guest speaker/panel at events such as the IEG Conferences and has been featured by nation’s top campuses like Yale, UCLA and USC MBA Program. Lam is also active in the Asian American Journalists Association. He received the 2018 Corporate Creativity and Innovation Leadership Award from the Child Creativity Lab and the 2018 IMPACT Award from the International Executive Council. Lam, his brothers, and Wahoo’s Fish Taco have been named one of the 500 Most Influential by the Orange County Business Journal, Best OC Brand by OC Weekly, the Golden Foodie Award and has countless awards for philanthropy and business achievements.
Timestamps:
00:53 - About Wahoo’s
03:14 - A marketing crash course
07:14 - Importance of brand association
11:32 - Conceptualizing a unique space
15:32 - Functions and the brand
21:55 - Wahoo’s and charity
31:40 - Future thinking
35:54 - Where to find Wing
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[00:00:30] Sid Shetty: Hello everyone, welcome to season three of Elevating Brick and Mortar. Thank you for joining us. I am here today with Wing Lam, owner and co founder of Wahoo's Fish Taco. Wing, welcome, thank you for being here.
[00:00:42] Wing Lam: Thanks for having me.
[00:00:44] Sid Shetty: I really appreciate it. Um, so Wing, for folks in our audience who might not be familiar with the brand, can you share some insight into Wahoo's fish taco?
[00:00:53] Wing Lam: Yes, we've been around since 1988. What started out with the little taco stand in Costa Mesa with me and my two little brothers, Ed and Mingo, has grown into over 50 locations across a few states and one location in Tokyo, Japan.
[00:01:09] Sid Shetty: That is amazing. Um, I want to dig in a little bit more about that, but I just wanted to let you know that you have a few fans and customers at Service Channel. Uh, when I mentioned I was interviewing you, a few folks lit up because they love eating at your restaurant. So, um, you're definitely doing a lot of things right.
[00:01:27] so Wing, as you mentioned, you started the restaurant 35 years ago with your two brothers. What inspired you to do that?
[00:01:35] Wing Lam: Well, as we always say, if you're not happy doing what you're doing, you can either complain about it or tough it out, right? So I decided, you know, corporate America at, you know, 1988 wasn't really ready for us Asian kids, I call it, right? It is what it is, right? But still a great land of opportunity, right?
[00:01:54] So my kid brothers and I decided to say, Hey, what do we really love to do, and we can do it basically with our eyes closed, right? So growing up in the food industry, my parents have had Chinese restaurants literally all over the world. Said we know how to cook, but we don't really want to do Chinese food in Southern California.
[00:02:13] It's already been saturated. So we said, how about a fish taco place based on the foods that we ate growing up surfing?
[00:02:22] everybody would come home and says, Oh my God, there's amazing fish tacos south of the border. Or if they'd come back from Hawaii, they goes, Oh my God, they have these amazing plate lunches. So I said, why don't we kind of bring it together? So we said, maybe we'll bring a little bit of the Pacific inspired cuisine, which is Asian, and we'll bring a little bit of South American, which is the Brazilian with the Mexican.
[00:02:44] So that's the inspiration. We say, Hey, we just want to have a place where surfers can hang out after or before surfing.
[00:02:51] And once people kind of got used to it, like, wow, this is different because it's one of those places and dishes that you can't get anywhere else in Southern California.
[00:03:00] Sid Shetty:
[00:03:14] Wing Lam: So I basically had to learn by crash course, how to get people in my stores. Marketing 101, you know, so how do you get people to buy your product, how to get them in?
[00:03:26] So I started going, well, where are they all at? You know, so I was racking my brains trying to figure that out because we were basically just scratching by. And accidentally, I got into event marketing. I had no idea what it was, but I figured, hey, if people can sample my food, maybe they'll come. Right? So you see a lot of people, you know, outside restaruants, a little tray with a little toothpick.
[00:03:52] I say, hey, try a little piece of this, kind of a thing. I'm like, that's a little, you know, whatever, right? And I thought maybe I can go to a surf event, right? Or a trade show. So Billabong, which at the time was one of the top four brands in the world for action sports, uh, A guy named Mike Lesher was my kid brother Ed's boss in the 70s at one of the surf shops.
[00:04:17] He said, Hey, you know, you, have you guys ever done, you know, a trade show party? And we're like, sure. We've done them all the time, fake it until you make it. And I'm like, how hard can it be? Right? It's a restaurant outside the four walls, right? So we set up a grill, did all that. And we made food for a bunch of people that would come to the trade show.
[00:04:37] And they're like, Oh my God, this is delicious. So the little trade show incident started this momentum where they say, hey, we have a party, we have a surf contest, we have a this.
[00:04:51] And I said, Whoa, it's an untapped market. Well, it turns out I found out why it was untapped because they didn't have a budget for it. So luckily for us, I said, why don't we just trade? You make t shirts and shorts, sunglasses, shoes, whatever. We'll trade the food for that. And they looked at me and goes, so you're gonna give us enough food for a hundred kids, and we're gonna give you shirts and shoes, whatever it has for your employees.
[00:05:17] I goes, yeah, that's all I want, right? So it wasn't necessarily free, and I had to figure out how to turn the, you know, Wearables into money. So I traded with my vendors. I goes, Hey, give me 10 pounds of chicken. Give me 10 pounds of fish and I'll give you some t shirts and hats. So we created this little ecosystem where everybody would benefit because my vendors had kids.
[00:05:40] So they're like, this is cool. Getting a billabong t shirt and a hat that's worth a lot of money. So you're talking Stussy, Billabong, Quicksilver, Gotcha. And at the time, pretty much the four biggest brands in the world.
[00:05:52] Sid Shetty: Wow.
[00:05:53] Wing Lam: And you can't have events without music. So all these little garage bands, like Blink 182, Green Day, Offspring became big bands. So guess who was there when they were starting out too? I was. So all of these little backstage, hospitality, I was the guy that goes, sure, I'll come up, feed you guys, take care of the kids.
[00:06:20] And all these little amateur surfers became the Kelly Slaters of the world, the Sean White of snowboarding, the Tony Hawk of skateboarding. So they became household names. And I was the guy, doing these little tiny events that today are the U. S. Open of surfing, the Dew Tour, the X Games, and I'm still doing them, right?
[00:06:43] Sid Shetty: I love it.
[00:06:44] Wing Lam: it's been a fun journey.
[00:06:46] Sid Shetty: You're so part of the community that as the community grows, like you're just associated with all the right people and you're doing the right thing. You're feeding them and they don't forget that, right? And, you know, when you, when you think about that, like what, what kind of sentiment do you want your brand to invoke when your customers think about you? Because they see you at these events,that brand association, you know, goes a long way. What do you want the customer to think?
[00:07:12] Wing Lam: Well, it's, I would say like 99 percent of people that buy Nike products will never play professional. But it's an aspirational brand because they're not cheap shoes, right? But there's something about wearing them and how it makes you feel. So, surfing, action sports, is the same thing. Most of the kids will never go on the world tour for any of these sports, but they'll aspire. So, by wearing that brand, it gives them that. So, I just wanted to basically be the side project that say, Hey, when you're thinking about the coolest moments in your life, whether it was the best wave you've ever gotten, where it was the best day at the skate park, you were rewarded with our food.
[00:08:00] Sid Shetty: Yeah.
[00:08:00] Wing Lam: the, you know, so there's positive reinforcement, negative reinforcement. I just be on the positive side. So every time you're thinking about. Thinking about, Oh my God, I can't wait to go surfing. The waves are perfect, dah, dah, dah. Guess where I'm going to go afterwards. So it's the, the thing kind of goes hand in hand.
[00:08:18] Sid Shetty: That's right. The brand, the brand sticks with them and it's more about just the food, right? It's associated with happiness and comfort and fun and to your point like when they go surfing all of a sudden Mmm. They don't even know they're hungry and they find themselves in your restaurant. I love that. I love that.
[00:08:37] We'll talk more about that as well, but are you still involved in a very active way in the day to day operations or as, as the business grew, like, um, you know, your, your role has changed. How do you see what you do every day, you know, as, as the brand steward of your brand?
[00:08:56] Wing Lam: Well, there's a lot more planning these days because the events have all gotten way bigger. Right? It used to be like a pop up tent and come and go. Now there's the presentation. There's all the opportunities to do pre R ahead of time, social media. So there's a lot more opportunities to let people know that this is what you do.
[00:09:14] Why not let the people know that you're coming and how to get there and all these other opportunities. But I still love being the face and you can't be the face, and not show up.
[00:09:26] Sid Shetty: Right.
[00:09:27] Wing Lam: So people today will look at me and go, Oh my God, you're here. I'm like, where else would I be?
[00:09:32] And I want to remind people that this is what I love doing and that's why you need to come and support our business, right? So a lot of people just say, Hey, I'm going to be outside. Barking orders and telling people what to do. I'd rather be the guy in the kitchen, just making the food. I can still wave out of the window and people realize that, you know, after 35 years, I'm still the guy behind the food.
[00:09:57] Sid Shetty: Wahoos is more than just about the food. It's about the ambiance, the, the design, the decor, you know, the, the, the sentiment that comes with the brand and what you stand for. And you had mentioned that, Part of that overall experience is also your physical locations, right? Um, can you describe what those physical locations are? Like, how does it look? What does one experience when they walk in?
[00:10:23] You know, as it relates to the brand.
[00:10:25] Wing Lam: Well, I want to take you for that 30 minutes to a couple of hours, transport you to a little beach hut on the North Shore of Hawaii or on the beaches of Mexico.
[00:10:37] So you can't just have an empty space with a kitchen, right? You have to decorate it. So it has to physically look like you're in a beach hut. With lots of paraphernalia. So it's a blend of a, call it a taco stand and an action sports surf shop. So you see all the stuff there and you'll see signed skateboards, signed posters by all the people that you might have idolized or you might have competed against with.
[00:11:04] And for that moment you're like, you know what? Yeah, I remember that day that I was at the skate park. Oh, I remember that day that I was out surfing with whatever, right? Oh, I remember that day I was snowboarding. And that's what it's supposed to do. It's, you have to have this physical transformation.
[00:11:19] Sid Shetty: Is that something which you started intentionally like from like many years ago, How did you go about conceptualizing what a physical space for Wahoos would look like?
[00:11:32] Wing Lam: Well, it started out with basically a clean slate, but I always thought, yeah, this place is missing like the soul. Right? So after I started doing the trade shows, I started asking all the brands because, hey, can I have that banner after we're done with the trade show? Can I have that foam core sign? Can I have that broken surfboard?
[00:11:56] And they all looked at me and goes, what are you going to do with it? You're a restaurant. You're not a surf shop. I guess I'm going to decorate my empty walls with it.
[00:12:04] As soon as I put the first couple of signs up, all the other brands like, are you kidding me? You're going to give us free space to put our brand and promote our own billboards in your restaurants? Of course. So, First, it was a couple of broken pieces of skateboards, snowboards, and pretty soon I was getting brand new stuff that was used but signed by the professional riders as they would win world titles.
[00:12:30] So it became like a little museum slash place for people to put all their stuff up and people it became this rite of passage. You made it when your stuff was hanging in my restaurants.
[00:12:43] Sid Shetty: Oh, I love it. How did you, how did you stay in touch with the consumer to see like that, that it's resonating with them? You know, that the soul that you were bringing into those physical spaces, by bringing a lot of character in there and then each, each thing that's on the, on the wall meant something.
[00:13:02] Wing Lam: Well, basically as things evolved I said, hey, how can I help you? The question was always how can I come into your trade show, your concert? And make it better. And ultimately I knew the answer is like, food. Because nobody had the budget for it, right?
[00:13:19] So everything that would happen, they're like, oh my god, Wing can you help us? I'm like, of course. So as snowboarding was starting in the early 90s, guess where I was? I was up in the mountains. And people look at me and goes, you're going to go all the way to the snow and that's where the event is. Right? The skate park, that's where it is. So anything that would happen, mountain biking, I would schlep over there. And people are like, this guy's crazy. Am I going,
[00:13:47] Sid Shetty: I love it. Yeah, it's like you're so in tune with the culture, you know, when it comes to some of these things that You know where you want to be because you want to be there with the best of intentions. You're not doing it just for, to grow, to grow your business. You're there because you love it.
[00:14:04] Wing Lam: I love it.
[00:14:05] my job is just to be there and support it.
[00:14:08] Sid Shetty: I love it. Wing, you know, as you know, a lot of the folks in our audience, you know, are from functions that support the built environment, right? Let's, so facilities, construction, operations, uh, real estate and so on. In a world where everything is either, uh, digital or very e commerce heavy or, you know, focused on the top line, sometimes the functions that help create One of the biggest reflections of a brand, which is the physical space itself, are not given their due credit.
[00:14:43] Right. And as we just discussed, like for you, your locations are a representation of your brand. How do you think about, these functions, you know, as you've grown, as you've probably hired more people in those functions, how do you equate those functions to your brand and your growth? Because even if you look at newer store openings, like many times the focus is on the grand opening and then you kind of move on to the next one, right?
[00:15:14] There's a team there that's, you know, that puts all this effort to open the location and then post grand opening, they're maintaining it. So help me understand as an owner and co founder and someone who's so in touch with the brand, what do all those functions mean to you?
[00:15:32] Wing Lam: Well, anything that has to do with the back of the house, I call it, right? The maintenance, the repairs, everything, training, all that. Obviously we have a team in house. My kid brother, Ed and Mingo do a lot of that. We have Fabiana that does a lot of the training and all that. It's important. Because that little shiny object wears off after a few months of opening, then things start breaking, you know, and these need to be upgraded. So the part of it is you got to make sure that you maintain it, which is funny. It's like, Hey, you don't notice the air conditioning guy until it gets really hot. And I'm
[00:16:09] Sid Shetty: that's right. That's
[00:16:10] Wing Lam: Forgot to clean the filters. So there's the basic stuff that you don't think about. Until you run out of ice, you know, so these are all the little functions that you always have to keep an eye on, have schedules.
[00:16:24] So not only do you have to, you know, make sure that you do the marketing to get people in, you have to make sure that the experience once they come in is there.
[00:16:32] So these are all the things that without it, your store, as soon as one little incident happens, people are going to go, Oh my God, these guys are not professional. Because look at what happened here. Look at what's not working there. They ran out of this. So the whole supply chain, maintenance, everything is vital. Because as a brand, you're delivering the promise that you told them. Hey, we're really fun brand. You're, you've seen us at the events. We've seen all that. When you come to the store, we're going to deliver the same experience.
[00:17:04] Sid Shetty: That's exactly right. Yeah. And, and have you found Wing, that as you've grown and as you've added more locations, that It becomes more challenging and you've got to, you've got to remind your, your leadership, you know, who works in your team, that we can't forget about maintaining those spaces because ultimately, like you said, you have to deliver on the brand promise, right?
[00:17:27] Wing Lam: It's very, very important. I would say things that you don't think about, right? All these little things that are hidden, like at home, your little light goes on when your water filter on your refrigerator is ready to be replaced. Or in a restaurant when there's That little light doesn't exist, right? You just got to know that, hey, every three months, every four months, every so many days, you got to change a few things, right?
[00:17:52] So there's a lot of reminders, a lot of communication. And that's what happens. The more stories you have. The biggest key is the manuals and communicating what happens, what do you got to do.
[00:18:04] Sid Shetty: At what point when through your growth, and I'd love to know like, did you see Like a smooth and steady growth in terms of your locations, or was it like a hockey stick that happened like in the recent, how did, how did that evolution happen? And in that evolution, at what point did you say, okay, I need a leadership team, or I need people to like, start doing this for me because you need to be out there being the brand steward, you know, help me understand that.
[00:18:34] Wing Lam: I would say with the three of us brothers, and at one point there were four of us, Steve, that came in as another partner, we say, Hey, there's four of us. Technically we can all manage a store, right? And kind of keep an eye on the ball. As soon as we got to about, five and six, everything changes. That's where manuals and communication became vital because physically we can't be at two places at the same time.
[00:19:01] And we all know that no matter what we do, somebody that's next to us is going to do the same thing, slightly different. It is what it is. So we have to say, okay, at least, it's okay if you do it slightly different. As long as we're delivering the same product.
[00:19:20] So that's where recipes, training, training, communication became vital. So it wasn't one of those we knew, we were forced into it. Because how do you tell a guy that hasn't been doing it for three years? Why these things are done a certain way.
[00:19:37] Always making sure that everybody's on the same page and why we do things. And along the way, we've made a lot of adjustments because some of our newer employees go, hmm, this is really nice, but have you ever thought of doing it this way?
[00:19:52] So we're always open to suggestions, but don't change the game plan because ultimately we could lose the game if we change the play.
[00:20:02] Sid Shetty: there you
[00:20:03] Wing Lam: The world is, you know, I don't have time for complainers. I love solutions.
[00:20:08] Sid Shetty: Right, right, right. As you look at the future, um, what's your vision and, you know, what is your goal in terms of, you know, spreading the value that you have and you know, the food that you bring to the table and the sentiments that you would like to share with, you know, your consumers, like what does your growth plan look like? Where do you want to be?
[00:20:29] Wing Lam: Well, we just recently got accepted into the John Wayne Airport, which will be in construction in Orange County for the next nine months, give or take a few days. So that's exciting. We're going back into Austin, Texas later this fall as well. And we're looking at a lot of other possibilities, I call it, because there are people in other states and also in our backyard that want to open restaurants, including ourselves.
[00:20:53] So it's an exciting time to be here. Kind of finally get through this COVID period of our life, but at the same time, it's like reminding people, it's one thing to talk about making fresh food, it's another to make it, because there's so many of our contemporaries that are much better at basically making things somewhere else and transporting it from a commissary to a restaurant location. Which is very efficient, don't get me wrong. But there are certain things that happen in transporting food, i. e. you have to stabilize it from A to B, and stabilizer is a wonderful fancy word for preservatives.
[00:21:35] So I find that a lot of things that you're eating may taste good, but may not necessarily be good for you. It's like, hey, if you're eating clean, fun foods, you'll be able to do the activities that You know, that you enjoy. So that's, for me, it's like, it's not about how big, but it's how good we can make things for us.
[00:21:54] Sid Shetty: Uh, you know, just snowballed, and today I think it has become into an organization called California Love Drop. Um, can you share more about that, and why you started it, and what it's become today?
[00:22:24] Wing Lam: Well, back in April of 2020, when everything stopped.
[00:22:30] Overnight, we lost 85 percent of our business. And we had food that was getting ready to spoil because it was prepped and it was like, we're going to throw it away. And I said, Hey, there's nothing going on. Why don't I take care of some of the front liners? Cause I had a lot of people in the hospital world that were working double shifts. So I took and repurposed what we're going to get ready to throw away anyway, and made meals for about four different hospitals in Long Beach.
[00:22:58] I get a phone call within a week from my girlfriend, Wendy, you know, that worked at KLOS. She had just gotten furloughed from the radio station and goes, what are you guys doing? And I says, we're out making deliveries. And this is, well, can I help you in any way? I'm like, you know what, we're out of money and we deliver what we could.
[00:23:20] And she goes, Wing, why don't I use the radio station to create a GoFundMe page on KLOS and tell the listeners that if you got nothing better to do, why don't you donate some money to this group that we started called the California Love Drop, and we'll go out and feed the front liners.
[00:23:39] So everybody started throwing a few dollars in. And all I said is we need to cover our cost.
[00:23:45] Then I called my friends at Monster Energy Drink goes, Hey, any event going on? It was nothing. Nobody's even working. I says, can I come by and get some drinks? They're like, you can have all the drinks you want.
[00:23:58] There's nothing going on. So I'm like, hand it over. Then I call my buddy a Hint Water. He goes, what are you doing? The answer was all the same. Nobody's doing anything. Cliff Bar. So we started going out to the police, fire, hospitals with Wahoos, Yogurland, Cliff Bars, Hint Water, and Monster Energy drinks. And the nurse was like, oh my god, this is amazing.
[00:24:23] Right? So slowly, they started reopening the venues, slowly they started having the concerts again, right? But there's still a lot of requirements. And I said, hey, as we slow down on the hospital and all that, we can now take our whole group and help the charities. So that's what we started doing.
[00:24:44] We're out there supporting all the local charities. So we work with the military. We work with the Boys and Girls Club, the YMC. So we're out there saying, Hey, what do you guys need? So we basically revamped all the toy drives, all the back school supplies, all the computers, everything that people needed. so it's been great. It's been a great run and there's no stopping us because we have the amazing radio partnership that gives us a platform to let the world know what we're doing. And that's where all the other brands goes, Oh my God, you guys can create this amazing content opportunity for us to ride alongside of your event.it's an amazing opportunity for us to do really good for the community and create amazing social media content for all the brands involved.
[00:25:37] Sid Shetty: that's amazing. Congratulations on what seems to be a very, very, uh, well intended and phenomenal movement. So, that's awesome. Wing, let's pivot a little bit, right? I want to get your take on, you know, The post COVID world because, you know, you've been doing this for a while now and I'm sure, you know, there's a new kind of sentiment that has taken place, uh, or movement that has taken place post COVID because it seems like customer expectations have evolved and maybe are heightened, right?
[00:26:08] And it sounds like the restaurant industry has bounced back. I'd love your take on that. What is different about the post COVID restaurant world?
[00:26:17] Wing Lam: Well, the post is because of the, the newest California wage increases, right? The fact that so much gas price, everything is up with labor going up, food costs goes up, right? So you have this whole new, uh, I call it issue because everything literally is 50 percent more than it used to be before COVID. Well, at the higher end restaurant group, a steak goes to from 20 to 25, nobody blinks, but at the quick, casual and fast food. A hamburger goes from 2 to 2. 10. People are like, Oh my God, highway robbery. And we're like, we're not even passing on the real cost. It should go from 2 to 3, 50%. We're talking 5 percent and people are already having a meltdown about it, right? So there's that disconnect. And the fact that so much of this generation got so used to engaging with somebody else via social media, via some device, not person to person. So you have this lack of interest of employees wanting to deal with customer face to face. So it's very difficult for us to recruit employees to work in the food industry. So there's this lack of new employees. So we're basically running from an employee point of view, probably 20 to 30 percent below our capacity. And it's not that we're not looking, it's just that we can't get people to come to work for us.
[00:27:49] Sid Shetty: That's right. That's
[00:27:50] Wing Lam: So typically if you come into any of our locations or any of our competitors locations, you might wait an extra, 10 to 20 percent longer to get the same service because we're short staffed. So that creates this little anger moment because you're so used to getting your order done, let's say, in three minutes.
[00:28:11] So I remind people, it is a new world. It's 30 employees in the kitchen all running around. We might have 20. And again, you have this mentality of the internet.
[00:28:25] Instacart, the thing gets delivered immediately to your house, right? Or anything like that. We're humans, and there's a little bit of time lag in between the time you order and the time, you know, things happen. So this is all the stuff that the new adjustment that we're going through.
[00:28:41] And then how do we deal with the anger management of people having to wait slightly longer and how do we deal with the new cost and the labor and all that? So there's a lot of moving pieces that are pretty much out of our control. It's what's going on in the economy.
[00:28:57] Sid Shetty: Yeah, and, yeah, and a lot of the conversations that I have with folks in the space are very similar, right? And you bring up a very fascinating point about the whole return to office thing, right? In some cases, you know, folks are coming in twice a week, in some cases thrice a week, but not all offices are back to five days a week, and which of those days people are coming in, you know, uh, impacts the traffic in your restaurant.
[00:29:26] You know, consumers today are interacting with brands in so many different avenues, right? It's not one single channel. It's not just the in room dining experience. It's Uber, it's DoorDash. It's, you know, your website. It's ordering on the website and pickup. How, you know, as an owner who's so tied to the brand experience, how do you ensure consistency?
[00:29:50] Wing Lam: I wish I could have a stick to say, Hey guys, if you're going to make an order. Please pick it up on time. Please deliver on time. So I would say more often than not, from the time the order is placed and the time the order is delivered to the customer, it could be 15 minutes to 45 minutes. So think about that for a second. Certain items travel very nicely. A bowl, for instance, right? And, you know, not a lot's going to happen to it, but if it involves bread, if it involves a tortilla,
[00:30:28] Sid Shetty: Or taco.
[00:30:29] Wing Lam: it, or a taco, is it going to stay here? You know, crispy. Is it going to get soggy? I, so the, the experience I can't control when you're using a third party.
[00:30:39] Sid Shetty: yeah, yeah,
[00:30:40] Wing Lam: So that's the dilemma. I love the convenience of the third party. I just make sure that maybe you could order items that transport, and are able to stand the time difference from when you order and when it's delivered. And not items will travel well.
[00:30:58] Sid Shetty: As you look into the future, you know, and you look at the industry as a whole, not specifically just your brand, right? There's a lot of new things being tried out. A lot of technology is making its way into the hospitality space, right? There's robots serving food, like, big, big robots. Busing tables, uh, there's kiosks that are more ubiquitous now to order food.
[00:31:19] Some are testing drones to deliver food. There's so many different things that restaurants are having to try out, back of house and front of house, some of which is driven by the fact that there's a labor shortage, right? Um, how do you look at that and say, you know, This is what I need to think about as we, as we move forward.
[00:31:41] How do you look at it as an owner? And then what do you think will stick? You know, what will stick, what won't?
[00:31:47] Wing Lam: Well, we've all talked about it, right? Kiosks would be a great example, right? A customer comes to us for the experience. Will a kiosk take away from it? Some instances, yes. Some instances, no. I'll give you the two examples, right? If you walk in and as a regular customer and you don't see your regular cashier, a kiosk is not a bad option because that new cashier may screw up your order. Because it's a fact because if you're one of those customers that likes to tweak the menu
[00:32:27] Sid Shetty: Yeah.
[00:32:27] Wing Lam: There's a good chance that that new cashier is not gonna forget that you don't like cheese It's not gonna you know what I'm saying? But a kiosk boom boom boom is gonna get you exactly what you want. At the same time, right? It could take away from why would I want to talk to a kiosk because I see, you know, Rose in the back there and I want to go to Rose because I want that friendly face to welcome me back and say, Hi, how's your kid? How's this? How's that? And she knows exactly how my order is going to be done
[00:33:01] So we've talked about all this, how to take the kiosk and instead of making it a replacement for our cashiers that have been there for a long time, as a way to speed up the process in case a new customer comes in and Rose is busy. So now you can get in there, do your thing, go sit down. Ping Rose, and Rose comes out.
[00:33:25] So this is all the stuff that we've talked about from a front of the house operation that would allow the customer, Bob, to feel like, hey, I got acknowledged. I got the food that I wanted, and I didn't waste time sitting behind a new customer that didn't know what he wanted.
[00:33:45] Sid Shetty: Right. I love it. You know, I think you're spot on. I think a lot of the folks that I've spoken to have said similar things that ultimately The hospitality industry is, you know, the people business, right? You're in the people business. So you don't want to ever lose that touch. Um, you can augment that experience with technology, uh, but you're not going to want to replace it.
[00:34:08] And so I think that's kind of one thing that I've heard consistently from a lot of the leaders and owners that I've spoken to and that makes total sense. People want convenience, but they also want that smiling face when you walk into a space, right? Um, so I love it. As you look into the future, Wing, what does the consumer of the future look like? Uh, and how are you preparing for it?
[00:34:32] Wing Lam: I think ultimately consumer wants what they can't make at home, right? If you can do it yourself, as we know, DIY, whatever, it's all over the place, all over the internet. Oh, why do I want to pay a guy to come and fix this? I can do it myself, right? So, the idea is, part experience transporting them from that moment to their little beach hut, and part of it is like, hey, I don't want to make this, I don't want to clean up.
[00:34:57] Right? So that's what we want them to do is, hey, reinforce and also give you that little break from your hustle and bustle. Cause ultimately, even at 20 an hour, Right? By the time you pay for your meal, and you prep and clean up, that meal, based on your 20 an hour, costs you about 40 in supplies and time.
[00:35:20] So, is that 40 worth you coming in for me and spending, you know, 15? Right? It's worth it because it just saves you 20 just on labor alone. So that's what we want to be able to do, because hey, make it so experience is there, and it's also worth your time.
[00:35:39] Sid Shetty: There you go. Well, with that Wing, I just want to say a huge thank you. I have thoroughly enjoyed this conversation. I really appreciate you taking the time, um, for all the folks in our audience who want to look you up or find you, uh, where can they do that?
[00:35:54] Wing Lam: The easiest place on Instagram, look at at WahoosWing, so W A H O O S W I N G. So it's the easiest place to find me, hit me up, tell them how much you enjoyed, see it, or not enjoyed our show. And, uh, you know, and if you ever see me at any of the events, say, hey, really enjoyed your, you know, the conversation we just had.
[00:36:18] Sid Shetty: Love it. Well, with that, I just want to say a huge thank you again. And to all those in our audience, thank you for joining us. And I'll see you on the next episode of Elevating Brick and Mortar.
[00:36:28] That was Wing Lam, owner and co founder of Wahoo's Fish Taco. It was a fascinating conversation. And what struck me the most was that in a world where there's a lot of social media and influencer marketing influencing consumers on where to spend their time and money, Wing has found his own unique and effective way to stand out and build a brand around himself.
[00:36:49] Not only does he do this in an extremely genuine way, but he's been doing this for 35 years. Wing also shared how important his physical locations are to his brand. He takes a lot of pride in the experience and sentiment his locations invoke, and so he fully understands how important it is to maintain these locations after the grand opening.
[00:37:11] He also discusses how technology will play a huge role in the hospitality industry. But the trick will be to leverage it without compromising on the human experience. Because ultimately, the hospitality business is a people business. With that, thanks for listening. I'm your host Sid Shetty, and I'll see you on the next episode of Elevating Brick and Mortar.